EP. 85 “Bread, Music, and the Great Accelerator: Joshua Grange’s Insights on Life’s Harmonies”

0:01 – Jim Serpico
My name’s Jim Serpico and this… Should I start with my name? Or should I start with this is Bread for the People? Do you like it like this? Welcome to Bread. Or do you like it like this? Welcome. Ready? Welcome to Bread for the People. My… There a script?

0:35 – Jim Serpico
Welcome to Bread for the People. I’m Jim Serpico. Very excited about today’s show. I have a guest beaming in from Nashville, Tennessee. He’s an inventor. He’s a bread baker. He’s making a tremendous contribution to the bakery. Baking and bread industry. Joshua Grange is on the show today.

1:04 – Jim Serpico
Can’t wait to talk to Josh. Before we bring him on, just wanted to get your opinion out there. Father’s Day is coming up, and I sent a text to my family, my three kids and my wife, with a link to the gift I want. Is that bad? Am I supposed to be surprised? Is it supposed to be up to them? I asked them for a Joe Dart bass guitar that I saw on Instagram. There’s an introductory, low-price, level, $399 Joe Dart bass guitar available for one month only. And it’s very much modeled after the original Joe Dart bass guitar. That was quite, much more expensive than that. And why do I want a bass guitar? Some of you may know this. I have a music background. I grew up as a trumpet player. I went to music school at Ithaca College. And that led me into music representation, which led me into representing comedians, which led me into producing for comedians, blah, blah, blah. I eventually kind of gave up my music passions, but I’m really into music. And when I bake alone, I watch Rick Beato on YouTube, and turns out Rick was my professor at Ithaca College. And the one thing I never mastered was ear training. I was a technician, I was a proficient trumpet player, I was a very amateur bass player, but I am thinking of trying to use this as meditation. And my goal is to use this instrument to train my ear and interval training because I have always admired the people where you could see what they’re thinking or humming is coming directly out of the instrument with no filter in between. To me, that’s a beautiful gift. That either some people were born with, because I do believe some people have a natural knack for it than others, a God-given gift where it just can be done, or you have enough of a gift where you can train yourself to do it, but I never did that, and I don’t know if I’m gonna be able to find the time to do this, but I have a feeling if and when I do it, I’ll be zoned out of the rest of the world, so. That is my interest in getting a Joe Dart bass guitar, which brings me up to my next guest he is the inventor of Dope The website is get dope comm I saw this product on a friend of mine’s Instagram and I decided to get it because I As a baker, I wash my hands no less than 35 times a day. I use everything from a sponge to an abrasive sponge to steel wool.

4:26 – Jim Serpico
And I have scraped my hand with the steel wool. It’s gone through the skin.

4:34 – Jim Serpico
And if not gone through the skin, it hurts like hell to the point it’s hard to wash it again. So I get this product called Dope. And I looked, it’s a, I massage my hand now every time I bake, it feels great. I love it, I used it about 40 times this morning. My son was baking with me, he used it.

4:58 – Jim Serpico
If and when we get our brick and mortar store, I plan to buy dozens of these things. Because I really believe in the product. I think it’s a beautiful thing. It’s, we’ll get into it with Josh. He invented it. We’ll talk about the material, but it feels great. It doesn’t hurt your hand. Um, you’re not even using soap. You’re using water and you’re using this certain type of, I don’t know if I want to call it plastic. I don’t think that’s exactly what it is, but Josh will tell us what it is. Um, so I can’t recommend it more. Go to get dope.com and check out this product. But now, check this out. Josh not only has invented dope, he’s a professional touring musician. He’s an engineer. He works at a studio in Nashville, Tennessee. He’s toured with people like KD Lang, Lionel Richie, the Dixie Chicks, and Beck. This is pretty interesting. Please welcome Joshua Grange.

6:03 – Joshua Grange
How we doing, my friend?

6:03 – Joshua Grange
Hi, Joe. How are you? That was entertaining. Good, good. But it’s Jim. I’m sorry, Jim. Sorry, Jim. I was thinking Joe Dart, because I have a funny story about that that I’ll tell you about. Do you?

6:18 – Jim Serpico
Yes. Are you a Joe Dart fan?

6:21 – Joshua Grange
It’s gonna tie into this and into your story as well, I think. So I’ll get to that. But I was just smiling listening to that intro, man. You’re cracking me up already. I have a big smile on my face, yes.

6:37 – Jim Serpico
I met you through Instagram because I did love the product and still do love the product. And it’s a relatively new product. Yes. Tell us exactly what it is. I tried my best to describe it.

6:53 – Jim Serpico
From your point of view, what is it? Jim, you were right on.

6:56 – Joshua Grange
It’s a 100% silicone scrubbing bar that helps bakers get dough off their hands quickly and easily without using soap. And just like you, man, I was washing my hands so many times a day trying to get dough off of it. And just on one of my trips to the sink, this product came into my mind fully formed. And I thought it had to exist, and I went online to try to buy it, and it was nowhere to be found. So I set about trying to create this bar. It basically looks like a bar of soap with nubs on it. And it just gets dough. It’s the perfect tool for getting dough off of baker’s hands really easily. 100% silicone. It’s an American-made silicone, very high quality, that they use in Hollywood actually for prosthetic devices. So it’s lab tested to be skin safe, hand and skin safe, which is really important to me to make sure that it’s American-made using American materials. So it’s very high quality. You can feel good about using it all the time. I say it’s like a hug for your hands. So you were right. Every time you use it, it’s like this little massage that you get from it.

8:16 – Jim Serpico
Oh, it really is. And I didn’t read that anywhere. I’m just telling you from my experience, I really love using it. I really do.

8:24 – Joshua Grange
That’s so funny. I love it.

8:26 – Jim Serpico
And it works great. So I get, you know, coming up with like the idea or saying this must exist, but taking it to the next level and trying to figure out how to source and create a prototype is fascinating to me. So how did you find out about the right material? How did you come to the right material to use for this idea?

8:50 – Joshua Grange
Well, so you come from an entertainment background.

8:55 – Joshua Grange
Right.

8:56 – Joshua Grange
And the older that I get, the more I start to see connections between things. That you might look at different disciplines, that they seem different, but there are actually so many commonalities between the two. Like when I’m making dope, which is D-O-A-P, dough soap, those two words together. So when I say dope, it’s D-O-A-P. But when I’m making that, I’ll notice that in the hot months, man, that silicone cures so much faster and it can get away from you. Sometimes it can cure too much. So there’s the temperature connection. So, you know, when it came to making it, As a lifelong musician, and I’ve been playing music since I was a little kid, I started… I had a piano at my house from an early age, but I started guitar lessons with a teacher when I was 11. One of the things he taught me was ear training from a very early age. And I will say that that is the most used skill when I play music, and it has maybe been the crucial link to why I’ve been successful as a musician. Because I can hear things and know how to apply it to an instrument. There are some people that are born with perfect pitch, but it’s not going to help you come up with things creatively. You might know certain notes because you have perfect pitch. You can go, that’s an E, that’s a G. But anybody can learn ear training.

10:27 – Unidentified Speaker
Really?

10:28 – Joshua Grange
Anybody can learn that. That’s a skill that you can learn and apply. There’s hope for me? There is hope for you. And in fact, I made a music course, which I’m going to send to you, that pretty much shows how to develop this skill little by little. So I have some tips and tricks for that that are really helpful. But getting back to your question, It’s an artist mindset, I think is what it is. And one of the most crucial skills I think people can carry throughout their life is the idea of failing and failure and how that can help us in our lives. Failing doesn’t mean that you are a failure, right? Failing is a process. That we employ, it’s a tool that we employ to get better at things. And I’ve worked with tons of artists, man, they just, there’s no wall for them. They don’t hit a wall and go, well, that’s it. I’m at the limits of my abilities. I’m going to turn around and go, you know, do something else. No, it doesn’t exist for them. It’s not even a wall. It’s just a little tiny, you know, curb that they step over. Whether it’s them writing a song and not being able to come up with the next line, or making something up and it’s not coming to them in that moment, they know how to push through. They don’t consider themselves a failure because they’ve failed. They recognize that it’s all part of the process. And when it came to dope, I kind of just tried to be easy on myself. And I knew that I was going to have iterations of this that are going to suck, man. They’re going to be terrible. And it was in the beginning. I made things by hand. All these models, they weren’t right. The silicone wasn’t right. But I knew that if I kept it up, I would eventually come up with answers that I didn’t know. You know, answers to questions I didn’t know would even come up yet. And it’s all part of the process, and I think that that’s a valuable skill that I learned from making music and being around artists. And I think everybody is an artist. And I think that we carry that throughout our lives, that skill.

12:37 – Jim Serpico
Think so and this exact topic of failing. It’s something that’s been talked about in my house for the last week Twofold one is my wife and I Joined up with a a consultant in the restaurant slash pizza business, but it’s more than that. It’s a networking group. There’s about 75 of us that have signed up for this guy’s course. His name is Mike Bausch, and he is a leader He’s not only a master pizza maker, but he has eight successful restaurants. He’s a former he was in the Marines his family was in the Marines and He is a great teacher and One of the lessons we meet every Monday on a zoom 10 a.m. Mountain Time and He was talking about failure and failure is the opportunity to learn from those failures so you’re constantly failing up and to become better at something you have to fail you have to be willing to try and as long as you take lessons out of those failures failures are a gift and then coincidentally Gary Vee Just gave a commencement speech. He’s a I guess he’s a famous sports agent slash motivational speaker and he was also talking about failure and It’s okay to fail And he was actually anti giving trophies out to everyone because he wants people to experience failure and being able to learn from that. So I relate to that and certainly believe in that process.

14:26 – Joshua Grange
Yeah, I don’t think that people are afraid of failing. I think they’re afraid of being a failure. And those are two such distinct concepts, but we tend to conflate them just because the word fail is in them. So I think it’s a failure of language, is what it is. Yeah, but all successes… Are predicated on our failures. And like you said, they are learning opportunities. Do you learn more from failures than successes? I don’t know. I mean, maybe, but it is a waste to not learn from those failures. And God knows if you court them, this is the thing, if you open up the gates and court these failures, actively look for them, boy, you’ll just grow at an exponential rate. I think so.

15:16 – Jim Serpico
I mean, music is something that you become better and better at. So it’s interesting, you know, when you first pick up an instrument. Does someone think they’re a failure because they can’t play it?

15:30 – Joshua Grange
Yeah, and then there are plateaus. Oh, yeah. There are plateaus where you go, oh boy, I’m sucking now. I’m not growing like you have these spurts of growth. But you know, a lot of that, for instance, you were talking about meditation. So in this music course, I also have this guide of how to practice, basically. And one of the tips that I give people is, it’s almost like what they do when you go to a gym. Don’t set your goals super unrealistically and super high, and I’m going to practice for 45 minutes a day. Here’s what I tell people. Practice for five minutes a day. Set that goal. Five minutes. Get your butt in the chair, grab the instrument for five minutes. I guarantee you, most times it’s going to last longer because you do enter into a flow state which is very much like meditation. You’re able to just focus on a present moment and what you’re doing. Time seems to stretch out and distort and get pretty weird. But if you get your butt in that chair for five minutes, I guarantee you that it’ll be longer and lead to actual practicing. You will do that. I mean, I kind of do the same thing with pushups or jogging. Go for one mile. I’m not going to set a goal of five miles. I’m not going to do this. But one mile, I can do that. Come on. Three pushups. Here we go, Jim. Come on.

16:58 – Jim Serpico
I need to do that. I need to get back on that bandwagon. Me too, man. Me too.

17:03 – Joshua Grange
But you’re making a lot of bread, aren’t you? I listened to a podcast that you did recently where you were talking about kind of where you were at. I think it was last November, maybe? You were kind of talking about where you were at.

17:17 – Jim Serpico
That was a bleak episode. No, no.

17:19 – Joshua Grange
Actually, I thought it was really great to listen to this perspective because I think everybody goes through that. What the hell am I doing? What is going on? And then even grappling with, here is something, maybe if I’m reading this right, which I think about all the time, and to have the grace to think about. Here’s something that I was really interested in. Sometimes it’s hard. Are there other things? Is it OK to explore these things, let go of certain things? Grappling with the nature of change, which is really hard to do. Because change is grief, right?

17:54 – Jim Serpico
Yeah.

17:55 – Joshua Grange
Grief is when something changes beyond, you know, we can’t go back. We cross a threshold and we can’t go back.

18:00 – Jim Serpico
Yeah. At the point I recorded that, I was really at a crossroads between my entertainment career and what I was trying to do with bread. And neither was really hitting where I wanted it to. And to be honest with you, I lost the gusto. Um, At some point, listen, you go through these phases where I was in the zone and in the zeitgeist of the entertainment thing, and I had a team, I had access to being able to fly to Los Angeles a week, a month, and I was doing that for many years, and you make stuff happen. And gradually over time, you know, certain deals go away, the business changes, they don’t have these overhead deals anymore, this and that. Some certain people in your life retire or whatever. So it got to a point in my life where it became a drag, everything about it. And I was hanging on because at times the money’s real good in that business. And, you know, I know like money’s not enough to keep you happy. And the money wasn’t the same anyway. And I really had this passion for making bread as a technician, but also the business side. And you talk about these things that overlap. You know, when we study essentially restaurant management with this group we’re in, it’s very similar to producing film because your menu is your script, like if you’re gonna open a restaurant and you design a brand and a menu, you have to figure out how to execute this menu, which means how many people, I have to schedule workers, how many people can I afford to actually put on the schedule? It’s like shooting a scene in a television series. I can’t go over 25% of what I think I’m going to make by selling these menu items. You have to break down your cost of goods. You have to create recipe cards that cost out what each dish costs. This is exactly what you do in film and television. It’s so related. And the beautiful thing about it for me is I don’t have to wait for someone to maybe buy it at a studio and then maybe make a pilot. I could bet on myself and take this chance but use those skills.

20:48 – Jim Serpico
So essentially in bread and food now, I’m a producer.

20:53 – Jim Serpico
I’m doing the same thing I was doing. And I’m trying to get it to that point on the real scale where I have the actual brick and mortar location and that’s what I’m doing. So that’s what’s changed since November and now. Like I’m all in and I’m looking at spaces every week and we’re working on getting that going. That’s exciting.

21:15 – Joshua Grange
Yeah. Very exciting. Yeah. I’ve noticed, so in music, I’m a producer. But that’s more like a director in film.

21:26 – Joshua Grange
So sometimes the terms don’t line up between music and film, but I know film producers really deal with a lot of specifics around budgeting and how to make something work. Hey, for producers, do they kind of act like sometimes an intermediary between the studio, like the source of the funding, and the directors in a certain way? Do producers ever work like that?

21:50 – Jim Serpico
Absolutely. So when you’re in TV, producers in TV are different than producers in film. Producers in TV actually are higher up in the hierarchy in television than they are in film. In film, the director is usually the shit. Now, the way we were set up, I had a team of producers, and I worked with an on-camera person who was a producer. I would be the intermediary between that person and the studios. That was a big part of my role, especially at the beginning of my career.

22:30 – Jim Serpico
But yeah, we would work with them, and sometimes they even assigned producers that are freelance to go on a set to make sure things are going their way.

22:41 – Joshua Grange
I was curious about that, about the roles and the interdisciplinary thing again, bringing one set of skills that you’ve learned, how that can transfer to another, given a little bit of creativity on your end and to realize that you already have all these skills that you can apply to something, even if it’s just mental skills, connecting some of the dots and saying to yourself, I can do this, I can do this thing. You know, I can learn how to do this. Like for me, I started on piano, but then I switched to guitar. And I, you know, play a lot of pedal steel as well. I play a lot of bass, right? But all those things are linked and related. And when you put in a lot of work into one aspect of music, maybe guitar, well, it’s not just like you’re starting from scratch because you’re switching instruments. There’s already this wealth of knowledge that you can bring to that. It might look differently. You know, it’s almost like learning an alien language. But when you know that A, the letter A equals, you know, this little squiggly thing, you know, an alien language, you can kind of translate that and go through that.

23:49 – Jim Serpico
As a producer in a studio, well, first of all, are you an employee of a studio or is this your studio?

23:58 – Joshua Grange
this is my studio right now this is my studio and I have an office for dope you know but it’s I mean it’s a mess man I have boxes I mean I’m like working you know I make the product myself I ship it out so that’s a lot of work but I I thought that the studio might look a little bit nicer. But yeah, this is a studio that I built here in Nashville and that I work out of So when I’m hired as a producer, it’s by an artist that likes my work or how I work and the type of music that I tend to have produced in the past.

24:36 – Jim Serpico
So they’ll often come to your studio to record?

24:41 – Joshua Grange
Yeah, exactly. There are times when we go to other studios to do that, but since I have a space, it’s more budget-friendly. It tends to be more budget-friendly, and I also act as an engineer, so I’ll set up the microphones, I’ll man the gear. So I kind of like to do all kinds of things, because they keep me interested, and I’m curious about things. And I find so many, like for bread making, you had mentioned the pandemic at one point in your podcast episode. And I find that the pandemic was a real inflection point for a lot of people.

25:25 – Joshua Grange
But the way that I look at the pandemic is I call it the great accelerator.

25:32 – Joshua Grange
whereby relationships that were trending towards greater intimacy and strength got there sooner. Relationships that were destined to dissolve got there sooner as well. Decisions we had to make in our life, certain crossroads, it just brought the whole timeline much faster. That’s how I look at it as the Great Accelerator. And during the pandemic, I really got into bread making, sourdough specifically, along with a good friend of mine whose wife was battling stage four breast cancer. And we started a little bakery and started selling bread to people all over Nashville. And making this bread was such a wonderful, I don’t want to say escape, but it was a very therapeutic way of channeling a lot of difficult emotions.

26:23 – Joshua Grange
And healing in so many different ways, you know, just to get your hands in something and make it and learn something new and you’re challenging yourself and there’s something so romantic about it and beautiful. And especially because you can eat this thing and where else are you going to find this kind of food? Really, where? You can’t really just go out and buy it, you know? Now in Nashville, it’s a little bit easier. To do that. But at the time, there were no organic, delicious sourdough places.

26:56 – Jim Serpico
Really? In Nashville, huh?

26:57 – Joshua Grange
Yeah, man, there weren’t, no, no. And we were making organic and I was like milling the grains, you know, it was like really good, really good tasting stuff. But I got really into it and I found it very fulfilling. And this is the idea that I wanted to bring up with you is the idea of being fulfilled. And people talk a lot about being happy and that’s great, but that’s like half the story to life is happiness. I mean, that’s fine. What makes you happy? I think that being fulfilled actually brings about happiness. The other way around doesn’t work. You can’t just lead and say, I want to be happy. Well, good, you know, good freaking luck with that. But if you chase what fulfills you, whatever that is, you’ll be happy. You will find happiness. Doesn’t mean people aren’t going to die and you’re going to have sadness. Great. We can hold both of those things. But as long as you’re fulfilled, you’re chasing what fulfills you, interests you, I think we’re gonna be okay, you know, in that case.

27:57 – Jim Serpico
I think you’ve nailed it. Yeah. I really do. I think that’s a great way to articulate what I’m chasing.

28:08 – Jim Serpico
Because there are elements of that there are certain things I don’t have in my life right now. Um, the camaraderie of working with a team, which is one of the reasons, like you could only make so much bread on your own. Um, I mean, it could be fulfilling at a certain period of your life, but you know, I personally want a team.

28:32 – Joshua Grange
Uh, connections are important, man.

28:34 – Unidentified Speaker
Yeah.

28:35 – Jim Serpico
You know, since the pandemic I’ve been, Doing a lot of this, whatever business it is I’m in or was in at the time was all from home and has been. And I wanna get out, I wanna separate my personal life from my professional life. I don’t want to live amongst my bakery anymore.

29:05 – Jim Serpico
And I want to output more. I want to actually make some income from this passion I have. And I want to use some of those film and television budgeting skills and scheduling skills to try to execute a new brand and concept. You know, that’s what, fulfill me.

29:23 – Joshua Grange
Yeah, I was gonna say, when the pandemic started, I don’t know why I did this, but the first thing that I did was I trained to be a crisis counselor for the crisis text line. It just felt like something I needed to do at that moment. Spent a couple months training and then I started acting as a counselor, crisis counselor, which was all done via text. I’d be at a computer, but people would be texting in. And the calls ranged from, you know, people breaking up with their girlfriends, or having troubles around, you know, the impending COVID shutdown and the world changing, to suicide, you know, people that were actively, you know, thinking about suicide. And it was the most fulfilling thing I have ever done. And this is coming from a guy whose only dream as a kid, since a young age, was to play music, which I’ve done and toured for 25 years. And you’re on stage playing, you get to meet and play music with your heroes. And I mean, it’s like, But that act of connecting with people in that way blew everything, it didn’t, it wasn’t even close. And it was transformative for me because I did see that as a solitary, I’m a very solitary person. I like, I’m a do-it-yourselfer completely, but it really did change the way that I thought about people and connections and about how vital and important they are. When we’re on our deathbed, you know, great, you did everything yourself, but I kind of, okay, here, this is a trip. Have you ever had a moment in your waking life, you’re in your kitchen, you’re doing something, you’re out, and all of a sudden, you think of something you haven’t thought of in 20 years? Someplace you’re, has that happened to you?

31:20 – Jim Serpico
All the time.

31:21 – Joshua Grange
All the time. Okay. Me too. I’ll think about like some restaurant I was in, in, you know, Michigan or, um, you know, walking through a supermarket one day with somebody. And I didn’t, do you know why we have those memories? Do you know why? No, they all shared, they all share something in common.

31:39 – Jim Serpico
What?

31:41 – Joshua Grange
is that we were present in those moments. We weren’t distracted. We’re not thinking about something else. We’re not thinking about things that are stressing us. We’re actually living in that moment and taking those things in. And they become these indelible snapshots in our life, that kind of presence.

32:00 – Joshua Grange
And so that’s an important thing, I think, to remember is that we set all these expectations for ourselves and, you know, whether or not they line up with things that actually mean something to us, you know, is important, you know, like to ask ourselves, what really fulfills me? Not with society’s lens on us, you know, or what will other people think. But definitely, man, hanging with some folks, that’s a good feeling. Having a team, being with friends, great feeling. Nature, too, being out in nature, getting your butt out there once in a while, that is really, really important. Hey, man, you ever see the sequoias? You ever go out to the sequoias?

32:37 – Jim Serpico
No, those big trees.

32:38 – Joshua Grange
Ah, well, you should do it go go to the sequoias Check those things out. You won’t believe it. You’re gonna love it Do it before you die man and do it before you die.

32:49 – Jim Serpico
It’s on my list. There’s a lot I want to do There’s a lot so man, there’s so many things I can ask you and I’m curious.

33:01 – Jim Serpico
I’ve toured. When I first got into comedy, the way I met Dennis Leary was I was his tour manager.

33:10 – Joshua Grange
Oh, wow.

33:12 – Jim Serpico
At the height of the famous Asshole Song.

33:16 – Joshua Grange
That must have been crazy.

33:18 – Jim Serpico
it was it wasn’t crazy crazy but it was exciting you know it was I was young I was not even 25 yet and oh man it was me dennis and two friends of his that went to emerson that were great musicians uh you know we had because his his song asshole was It was relatively a hit and it was part of his comedy thing and so they would travel with us and we went all across the country and they accepted me. They were 10 years older than me and they were very nice to me and we just had fun. Now, I’ve also seen not that I’ve been part of them, but bigger machines and touring machines. And some people keep to themselves. I’m curious to know what your experience as a touring musician is and what do you prefer? Do you prefer working in the studio? Do you like a balance of a little of both?

34:27 – Joshua Grange
Yeah. The second question first is that Studio sessions are amazing because it’s a pressure cooker and you’re being asked to invent things come up with musical lines and melodies on the spot and To deliver it flawlessly take after take because there’s other musicians, you know with you So it can be really high pressure and then you know after an eight-hour day of that you feel like you want to just turn your body inside out scrape it clean, you know and and Rinse it off with the fire hose. You just so squashed at the end of that mentally speaking But it’s a great feeling and I love that and working with people the chance to create things and Sessions are great that way But I love touring as well, you know, so it’s like what do you like, you know certain flavors I can’t pick one, but I will say that I started touring from a pretty young age like you about 25 and And there’s all kinds of people, there’s all kinds of situations. I mean, I’ve done van tours that I just love, you know, driving a van around the country with people. Everything from private jets. I’ve been on more private jet flights than I could count from some of these artists that that’s how they travel.

35:58 – Joshua Grange
the tour bus is waiting on the private jet airport. So the jet lands and you get right onto the tour bus. So there’s all kinds of ways. But I will say this, that truly the only thing that really matters is the company that you’re around.

36:20 – Joshua Grange
Yes.

36:21 – Joshua Grange
Where I have slept on airport floors, you know, mostly in Chicago because weather, you know, in Chicago, that will just cancel tons of flights. But you can sleep on an airplane floor when you’re around people that are just joking and having fun that you care about because They can keep you know a positive attitude and even if not, they can at least have fun with it You can get through anything with the right crew. Yeah, so that that to me has been the most important You know take away from a lot of the touring stuff So when you know if I go why am I not having fun on this, you know, am I the asshole now? You know, don’t be the asshole, right? Because when it comes to talent You’re not, you know, maybe for you is, you know, hiring, you’re gonna hire people, right? So just because somebody might be, you know, 10 or 15%, quote unquote, better or more talented, but are they an asshole? You know, you wanna hire the people that are gonna be the, you know, nicer people, more fun to be around.

37:24 – Jim Serpico
So that’s more important. This is everything in life, by the way. So there’s a couple things I wanna bring up. Related to that, I was at a meeting for a space with this guy who owns something called Bagel Boss, which is a pretty big bagel operation out in the East Coast, and in fact, they now have over 100 franchises around the country. And this was the head of the whole company. And he was giving us a lesson, and he was basically telling us, in bread and whatever, that you’re there could be people with better bread or the same bread. It’s all going to come down to your relationships. And do I like you? And if I like you, I’m going to want to give you the business, even if that guy’s bread is 10 percent better. It’s very much related. Yeah. Another thing, I just wanted to take this opportunity to throw in my my private airplane story. Oh, yeah. We’re talking about private jets. Oh, yeah. So there was a period of time where Dennis was was flying around in private jets and It’s you know, the first time you’re on a private jet It’s exciting as hell. I mean you everything about it, especially back then like this. There’s barely any security and The way it works is it’s not like a commercial airline where you’re eating their food. You actually have to order. You tell the plane company what you want. It could be any restaurant nearby. They’re going to get it. It’s like a concierge service.

39:05 – Jim Serpico
Dennis wanted McDonald’s and that was the thing. We would eat McDonald’s on the private flights. But he would smoke cigarettes on the plane.

39:15 – Joshua Grange
Oh, man. Really? Wow. Yeah, yeah.

39:19 – Jim Serpico
And it became, the funniest thing about this was none of us wanted to be on the private plane. So we would be like, no, you take the private jet with him. You go. Everyone was trying to not fly on the private jets anymore because we were covered in smoke.

39:35 – Joshua Grange
Oh, that’s funny, man. Oh, that would be, oh, I can’t imagine.

39:42 – Jim Serpico
We would call it the ashtray.

39:44 – Joshua Grange
I wonder if they still allow that.

39:47 – Jim Serpico
I wouldn’t be surprised. Maybe it just depends on the crew, too. I mean, I think you could almost get away with anything on a private plane. Cigars? Oh, man. I bet. But I don’t know. I haven’t been on one in quite a while. Yeah, they are they are very exciting Yeah That’s very true so the other thing that comes up is Nashville as this hotbed of everything and how because we we talk about do we do this concept in a different city and and people like not Nashville and Because it’s almost more expensive than New York at this point.

40:25 – Joshua Grange
I don’t think so. No, but it’s happening. I don’t know who told you that. You know what? Whoever told you that, they got plans to open one up themselves.

40:34 – Jim Serpico
That’s what’s going on. But it is. A lot of people have been moving there, right?

40:39 – Joshua Grange
Yeah, it’s been attracting people, I think, for quite a while now, for sure.

40:43 – Jim Serpico
Traffic has changed?

40:45 – Joshua Grange
It has, yep. It has. I live in an area called Music Row, which is traditionally an area that had a lot of studios. It’s basically two one-way streets. And this is where most of the recordings happened decades ago. But it’s been interesting to see the older properties being torn down and the new places coming up. So that’s a kind of a transformation. That’s sad. But you know what? I’m from LA. I was born and raised in Hollywood. And every time I go back there, it’s the same thing as well, even on a more disturbing level. When I go back to Los Angeles, just how much that that is changing. Growing, you know, an already unsustainable from population, you know, kind of a feeling. It’s just grown, you know, more obscene and imbalanced and unnatural. But that’s kind of why I like Nashville because it feels wild, you know. In Nashville, you can park your car facing in either direction on either side of the street And they don’t really give a shit. So that’s one of the most amazing things to me, where that would be a huge ticket in Los Angeles. Here it just feels a little bit more wild, you know what I mean? You see more cars parked in front of fire hydrants here. I will say this. Which I like, that people are pretty friendly. You can just walk up to somebody and go, hey, nice day we’re having. They’re like, yeah, it sure is. We’re in L.A., you know, if you were to say that, people want to know, are you crazy? What do you want from me? You know, they’re disturbed that somebody’s talking to them, basically, and wary.

42:28 – Jim Serpico
Okay, that’s something I think about a lot, too, because I now go out of my way to challenge myself to talk to people, because I’m also in sales. And since Bread, I have become the face of my brand since the pandemic, something I never would have done before. When I’m at these farmers markets, I’m proud that it’s my product, and people like to talk to the person who made it. And I’ve become more comfortable talking to strangers or customers, and I try to do that outside of the market, just in general. And New York’s kinda known as a place where, just what you said with Los Angeles, people would think you’re crazy, but I sometimes wonder, is that truly the case? Or are we so guarded that we just don’t usually do that? Because we think that’s the case, but people also want the connections. Because I find when I, my kids are embarrassed all the time, because when we go out together to restaurants, I’ll start a conversation.

43:38 – Joshua Grange
And it people are reciprocating don’t let them dim your light Jim Yeah, check this out so you toured you were on the road I don’t know how long you’re on the road for but like I was on the road for you know 25 years and I still do some tours but I mean I would meet thousands of people every year and And a lot of them I’d have these deep conversations with. I mean, I’m meeting tons and tons of people every single night. And for some people that would come to some of the shows, depending on which artist it was, these were meaningful adventures for them, you know, and getting to speak to a band member was exciting. And, you know, you could really connect and share things. And what I found was that it gave me a lot of intuition about people that I would meet, that I do meet now even. You can kind of categorize certain people, but we don’t. We don’t put a lot of stock in intuition. You know, it’s not measurable and, you know, we just, people don’t trust it. But I think that it’s a really important part, especially if you’re dealing with, you know, when you’re dealing with people, the concept of intuition, you know, feeling those little tiny signals that you pick up on. Because people pick up on them too. And when you’re really genuine, and when you are curious about something, people do tend to pick up on that. They can tell that you’re not crazy, that you’re actually, just personable and friendly. You know, so I mean, if that’s what you do, go ahead and do it. I think always talk to strangers. You know, where’s that pamphlet? We should make that pamphlet, man. Always talk to strangers.

45:24 – Jim Serpico
I agree. I think it’s the opposite. But you have to be comfortable. I see the difference, I think part of it’s with age and certain experiences. I think it’s natural, I’ll use my kids as an example. Hopefully they’re not gonna listen to this episode. They’re shy. And a lot of kids that age might be. Some are naturally outgoing, but my kids are shy. I was shy, very shy.

45:52 – Joshua Grange
Me too, man, very shy.

45:54 – Jim Serpico
Now I think, how does that change? How come you’re not shy at this point in life?

46:03 – Joshua Grange
I don’t know if it was exposure therapy. I mean, what a stupid career to choose when you’re a shy person is getting up on stage. I can’t think of anything more idiotic than that.

46:14 – Jim Serpico
There are a lot of people that do it. There are a lot of shy people that become actors and musicians.

46:19 – Joshua Grange
Well, see, it’s funny you say that. I have this theory that Every actor can sing and every singer can act. It’s the same muscle. But yeah, for me, maybe it was just a lot of getting up and doing it. There was an artist that I played with for like nine years, and for one year, She made me speak to the audience. She would call it, you know, Q&A or something like that with Josh, and I would just kind of make up these facts. I’d just be talking to this audience, making up facts about things, you know, like complete BS. But it was fun, but also, like, stressful. But I don’t know. I think the more you do something, the better at it you get. When it comes to, you know, Talking to people, I do think that it’s a desire for connection. That when you do have a desire for connection, you’re more apt to do that. Spread some joy, be a conduit of good things. In whatever measure you have, whatever you’re doing, doesn’t matter what your job is, you can be a conduit for joy, for happiness. You know, a place for people to kind of just have a fun moment, you know, and that’s a choice that we make. We make that choice. We get up and say, I’m going to be this kind of person. I’m going to do that. And it extends to all these little facets, you know, how you live your life, you know, how you express yourself, whatever it is that you’re doing.

47:43 – Jim Serpico
But there’s a lot, there are a lot of people that, um, for example, yeah.

47:52 – Jim Serpico
I, not me, but let’s say I’m making up a persona. I’m one of these very shy people, I’m young, and I’ve been to a vacation where everyone, or it seems like everyone, because there’s 300 people in a theater experience, and there’s karaoke night and people having a blast. And I practice karaoke in the shower, I pick out my karaoke song, But I’ll never pull the trigger and do it.

48:20 – Joshua Grange
I won’t. Karaoke, that’s my nightmare. Scary-oke. I’ll never do it, man. I’ll tell you what though, kids learn from their folks. So if they see their folks doing something, they’ll know that they can do it too. Like I have a friend, a good friend of mine, Fred Elstringham, great drummer. We’ve toured with tons of people over the years. And he has two brilliant kids, but they’ve seen their dad as he gets these projects and he’ll go down and he’ll practice drums for hours and hours and they’ll come and play with him and watch him. But they watched their dad do these things, have this discipline, and then they can just immediately apply that to their life. Oh yeah, here’s a thing. You go away and you practice and you do this. They know that. They know how to do that because they’ve seen it. They have the example. That’s how kids learn is from example. And that goes to how do parents grieve? How do they argue? What kind of conflict resolution? How do they express love? You know, all those things. Kids pick up on all that, adopt those tools, carry them with them throughout their lives.

49:28 – Jim Serpico
I can tell you that my wife, who is a psychologist, would 100% agree with you. And therefore I agree. She’s right. She’s always right.

49:37 – Joshua Grange
But now you must sing. I do background singing.

49:41 – Jim Serpico
Yeah, definitely. But that means you can carry a tune.

49:46 – Joshua Grange
I mean, I can get away with background singing. It’s funny, a friend of mine just wrote a book, Sarah Tomlinson, just came out with her first novel and she asked me to contribute a song to it, which I did. So I don’t usually do lead singing, but once in a while I’ll do it. It’s fun, it’s kind of a scary exercise, I think, to put yourself out there like that.

50:13 – Jim Serpico
That’s why you won’t do karaoke?

50:16 – Joshua Grange
Oh man, that just scares the living crap out of me, honestly. It just seems like too much, too much spotlight, and you know, it’s supposed to be fun, but you’re also, like, not fun, you’re also performing, you know, it just seems like too many things can go wrong, honestly.

50:31 – Jim Serpico
That’s so interesting.

50:32 – Joshua Grange
Oh yeah, god, it’s like my nightmare, man. Forget about it. I’ll watch you, though. I’ll come support you.

50:39 – Jim Serpico
Boo! It just depends on the night. There are nights there’s no chance I’m getting up there. Yeah. But you do it. But you do it. I have done it.

50:47 – Joshua Grange
Oh, you have done it. Okay. I have done it. So you have done it. I see.

50:50 – Jim Serpico
I wouldn’t say I’m a regular karaoke goer.

50:53 – Joshua Grange
You know what? So check this out.

50:57 – Joshua Grange
January, so what, so what year did the pandemic happen? 2020, right? Yeah. Okay. So, so January 1st, 2020, my resolution or whatever you want to call it was just to say yes. Someone called me up and they said, Hey, do you want to? Yes. Was the answer. Do you want to go out? Yes. Want to do this? Yes. So I would just say yes. And I ended up going out meeting a ton of new people.

51:25 – Joshua Grange
My friend Bridget from a group called Lake Street Dive one night said, hey, do you wanna go see, shit, I can’t remember his name right now, from Wolfpack, what’s wrong with me? The singer, singer. Okay, I’m totally blanking. Hold on. Totally blanking. But I said yes. Then we went out at night to a bar afterwards. I said yes. And so all the people went. And I got to hang out with your buddy Joe Dart that night.

51:54 – Joshua Grange
Oh, there you go.

51:55 – Joshua Grange
Late at night. Late at night. I mean, all of us hanging out. And I thought, see, this is why you just say yes. You know what I mean? You’re gonna meet people. You know, it felt great, man. Exchange phone numbers with a bunch of new friends. It felt great. And then guess what? Womp womp, COVID. Everything went to shit at that point, you know, as far as going out and doing things. But man, I remember that night. It was so fun and it just felt like, yes, you should do that. Just say yes. Go ahead, speak to strangers and say yes.

52:34 – Jim Serpico
I try to do that too. I try to not overthink it and just go for the experience. Which is what I’ve been doing with going to pizza school in Miami, Florida. Am I really good enough to be in it? This was a class for professional pizza makers.

52:55 – Joshua Grange
And you submitted your application a little late. Is that the one?

52:59 – Jim Serpico
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, I got in two days before or whatever. And yeah, actually, the episode that’s out right now is from one of the people in the class. There were 25 us in the class. These guys are some of them in the real deal with like six stores and USA Pizza team, but there was a certain experience about everyone’s away from home, everyone’s there focusing on this one thing for eight hours a day, and then we would go out, get dinner and drinks. So that’s December, and then this past, I think it was March, there’s an international pizza expo in Vegas, and my wife and I go, and all 25 members of the class are there, as well as the teachers. And if I didn’t have the guts to go out of my comfort zone and do this, none of these people would be in my life. Now they’re friends, they’re resources.

53:59 – Jim Serpico
I was present. I’m gonna remember those moments. Challenged. Oh, yeah.

54:06 – Unidentified Speaker
Yeah.

54:07 – Jim Serpico
Inspired.

54:08 – Unidentified Speaker
Mm-hmm.

54:09 – Jim Serpico
Yeah. You know, so many good things.

54:12 – Joshua Grange
Yeah, man. Do you ever just, do you ever wonder, like, if, or, I mean, people do this all the time, I guess, but you’re just, like, I think we do it when we’re kids, too. We just don’t really think about it too much, just about, like, what you want, you know, what would be fulfilling to you at any, like, moment, you know, like, whatever that looks like, For me, if I had a house, Small House and Big Sur, right, where the Redwoods meet the Pacific Ocean. I feel like I could just walk outside and breathe that in and I just feel like settled, you know, like this would be amazing. But who knows, maybe I could be there for a certain amount of time and go, God, I miss being out in the City, you know and having access close access to a grocery store some friends. I Feel like that always changes and it’s okay that that it that it does but but so like so for you What does it look like in the near future for you? Like where do you what are you going for?

55:03 – Jim Serpico
I’m going for a balance of things. I want the stimulation of having some form of business. I’m not saying it needs to be a financial windfall, but I want it to be able to pay for myself and contribute a little money to whatever I feel like spending money on, from my needs to maybe some whatever, and I would like to get away to somewhere like that, but maybe not that, but where I feel settled. I’ll be very honest, right now in my life I feel completely unsettled. So I’m looking for the ability to have a balance of both and I think that’ll make me settle a little bit.

55:57 – Joshua Grange
Yeah, that’s interesting because some people would say that you can look for ways that you feel unsettled and ask yourself if you actually have the means of eliminating some of that that makes you unsettled. It’s not always your circumstances. It has to do with you and how you approach being unsettled. You know what I’m saying? I do. How you deal with stress.

56:28 – Jim Serpico
That’s definitely part of it. Yeah.

56:30 – Joshua Grange
That’s definitely part of it. Yeah, because like having sometimes like being under a lot of duress and a lot of stress and a lot of change a lot of grief a lot of you know shit hitting the fan it will it will change the bar where you feel really stressed out you know for some people it’s like a very low bar where they get stressed out and then certain things happen and then you’re like I don’t even care about that anymore doesn’t even faze me that this is happening or that this is happening you know so That’s kind of an interesting thing, you know, when we’re out, like you said, shoot for balance. And I know what you’re saying, but a lot of times when we’re out of balance, however that looks to be out of balance, you know, whether you’re putting too much emphasis on one area of your life or you feel like there’s something that you’re not taking care of in another part, that’ll just throw everything, you know, out of whack. Nothing will feel good at that point, I think.

57:25 – Jim Serpico
Yeah, that, I guess, I think you’re right. I think when you talked about having the house in Big Sur and walking out, to me, that’s a physical, material thing where it’s very specific and to me that could only last, for me, only last so long because I need the stimulation of all the other things we talked about with the connections of people.

57:54 – Joshua Grange
I’m going to talk to squirrels, buddy. The squirrels, little animal, we’re going to be good. Sorry to interrupt you. Go ahead.

58:02 – Jim Serpico
I probably have the material things available to me right now, but I don’t have the mindset and the skills to enjoy them. Like a friend of mine, I had friends over the other night, my wife and I, a bunch of couples, and they said, do you use the pool? Because we have a pool. And I was like, my wife uses it every day in the summer when she’s off from school. I am not relaxed enough to enjoy it. I feel unsettled often. That’s an example, like I’m a little out of whack.

58:42 – Joshua Grange
Hey, five minutes a day. No, it’s true. Five minutes a day. Whether it’s going to be your new Father’s Day gift.

58:51 – Joshua Grange
Right.

58:52 – Joshua Grange
Or it’s going to be like two laps in the pool or three pushups.

58:58 – Joshua Grange
You’re right.

58:59 – Joshua Grange
Whatever it’s going to be, man. You can do it. Five minutes a day. I’m going to do it too.

59:04 – Jim Serpico
Listen, man, I’ve studied mindfulness. I’ve, I’ve gone to, uh, I’ve studied, I’ve listened to meditation. I’ve done it. I love it. I’ve gone to a certain kind of therapies, uh, where they teach you, uh, skills. And very helpful, and I’ll tell you what, at that time in my life, I was 25 pounds lighter, I had the energy, I was using it, but you know what, it goes in waves.

59:39 – Jim Serpico
Yeah, it does.

59:40 – Jim Serpico
It can’t always be perfect. I’m out of balance right now.

59:45 – Joshua Grange
A little out of balance, a little out of balance, but you know what? All things start as an idea. So just even recognizing that will be enough to set you back in balance. I have a good feeling about this. I can see you on video. You have a nice smile. You’re a warm guy. You’re passionate. You’re passionate about joy and food and sharing this. A lot of awesome things throughout your life, you know, things so many people never even get to experience. I can tell you’re going to bring that to this next chapter, which is unfolding before you, whether you like it or not.

1:00:26 – Jim Serpico
Was the singer Theo Katzmann.

1:00:29 – Joshua Grange
Yes, that’s exactly right at 3rd and Lindsley that would have been like in March of 2020 here in Nashville. Oh and to get back to it. Yes, you’re right Theo Katzmann and to get back what you were saying Nashville is a good it’s getting to be a better food town. It is ripe. Because I noticed that like, okay, Florida, when you go to Florida, you got to set your watch back 10 years. You know what I mean? Like it’s definitely like a thing. Nashville kind of has a similar sort of a thing. It’s kind of all mixed together. But I find that it’s a real fertile ground for experimentation and for bringing certain things that are really high quality that there is a market for it with people and the new people that are moving here because it’s an arts town. It’s a music town, but that means that it’s an art. It has a soul of an arts town to it too. So there’s a lot of burgeoning arts that are kind of moving up through it. I can see it bubbling through like magma, you know what I mean? Like Iceland or something over here.

1:01:35 – Jim Serpico
I’d love to experience Nashville Without Going on that strip ever Oh God, do not do it.

1:01:43 – Joshua Grange
Although there’s one place that if you that if you do come over here There’s one place. I’m gonna take you on Broadway It’s called Roberts and it’s the only place that you should visit on Broadway hands down There will be no There’ll be no guys swinging their class to me bags around the room like it kid rocks. That was a real thing. I’ve been there Oh, I’m so sorry.

1:02:05 – Unidentified Speaker
Ugh.

1:02:06 – Jim Serpico
So the one time I went to Nashville, I was basically the quintessential tourist.

1:02:13 – Joshua Grange
Yeah, yeah, yeah. I’ll help you out.

1:02:17 – Jim Serpico
It was an interesting weekend because I was representing a comedian at the time named Jim Brewer, who was opening for Metallica in Nashville, and my son was Jim’s videographer. And then he’s actually going back out with Metallica in August. To do some killer stuff. But then I got to see one of my favorite bands in a warehouse in Nashville. The band is called Lettuce. And they’re like a jam band.

1:02:50 – Joshua Grange
Yeah, I’ve heard of them. Oh man, the best fans.

1:02:53 – Jim Serpico
Yeah, yeah, and there was a really cool place. That was a local place. There were no tourists there, but it was a warehouse that must do these kind of jams.

1:03:02 – Joshua Grange
Yeah, Marathon, was it? Yeah. Yes. Yeah. I love that place for shows.

1:03:06 – Jim Serpico
It’s great. That was fun. But during the day we were on that strip all day, and it’s like it’s like every other strip somewhere It’s like Bourbon Street. It’s like whatever.

1:03:15 – Joshua Grange
It’s like oh, yeah You know no although one cool thing about broad about that strip Is that you can hear live music all around you because each five feet? There’s like a new place so that is almost that that is psychedelic. That’s almost psychedelic right there. Hey, man You ever try psychedelics?

1:03:35 – Jim Serpico
No, but you never have often never it’s often been talked about amongst me my friends They’re they’re more into the idea than me not that I’m against it. I’m afraid You are afraid mm-hmm.

1:03:47 – Joshua Grange
Yeah, well The places that scare you you know not always a bad thing. I don’t know why that thought just popped into my mind That might be something that, you know, he might get some value out of too. Because I just, oh, because walking along Broadway is almost psychedelic, you know what I mean? But it’s not the same as, you know, little tree frogs jumping on your shoulder, telling you things that you need to hear.

1:04:09 – Jim Serpico
I hear nothing but great things about them. I read studies about them. I assume you’ve tried them.

1:04:16 – Joshua Grange
Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, definitely. I found it. I found it very medicinal. I don’t know why I oh, I read a book called how to change your mind Mike Michael Pollan Okay about psychedelics and great book. It’s basically in three parts the history of psychedelics his his experience doing it for the first time, and then modern applications that they’re doing to treat all kinds of things, you know, from depression to PTSD. But it really made me curious about that. And I did mushrooms with a tea, which is the only way to do it. You make a tea out of it. And you know what happened?

1:05:00 – Jim Serpico
What happened?

1:05:00 – Joshua Grange
I ended up, and just by myself, I put on some music, The Meters, right? New Orleans, man.

1:05:07 – Jim Serpico
I danced. I love The Meters.

1:05:09 – Joshua Grange
I danced the entire night, and I’m not a dancer. I don’t dance. I mean, you know, we all kind of move. I danced the entire night. And it felt so good. I felt so good that day and the next day and for many, many days after that. Whatever it was, that’s what I needed at that moment, and I just went with it. So I had a really positive experience with it.

1:05:32 – Jim Serpico
Listen, a lot of people, I listen to this guy named Sam Harris. Yeah, yeah. He’s an educator.

1:05:40 – Joshua Grange
He’s smart guy, I really like him. Really into it.

1:05:45 – Jim Serpico
I’m convinced that there’s a therapeutic nature to it. 100%. I don’t know much about it and I would want to make sure that I’m not putting my body into some kind of weird thing.

1:06:00 – Joshua Grange
It wouldn’t be your body, but it would be your brain. You know, people that are clinically, you know, that have other kind of clinical mental diagnoses. But like, it’s easy to spot the people that should not do it, you know what I mean? Like, they’re the people that are usually on pretty high and serious medication. Other than that.

1:06:19 – Jim Serpico
But then there’s some, from what I’ve heard about it, is some of those people, maybe it helps rewire the brain. Absolutely, yeah. You know?

1:06:29 – Joshua Grange
Yeah. It really helps people that have deep-seated things that they can’t get past, or that medication has proved really ineffective, that it does get to the heart of certain matters and brings lasting relief to them. Cancer patients that are facing end-of-life that have severe anxiety when they’re treated with psychedelics they come to a very peaceful place and it really helps to leave that tremendous anxiety that they have and they they do feel peace.

1:07:02 – Jim Serpico
I think at that point, I will be on psychedelics 24-7.

1:07:08 – Joshua Grange
Psychedelic sourdough.

1:07:12 – Joshua Grange
Hey, is that a mushroom pizza?

1:07:15 – Joshua Grange
Yum. Love it. Look out. Man, there’s a video on YouTube I saw that I look back to. It’s in Amsterdam. And it is a drug meal, okay, it’s about 25 people and they’re invited to this drug dinner with like all these little appetizers and there’s, you know, pot in this thing and that thing and then going up to psychedelics and it is a frickin’ disaster, man. The chefs I don’t think really knew what they were doing. They overdosed everybody with these drugs and you slowly see most of the people drop off in one crazy thing or another. I mean, it’s hilarious.

1:07:55 – Jim Serpico
That’s funny. So it’s great to watch. It almost sounds scripted.

1:07:58 – Joshua Grange
Yeah. Oh, that’d be an incredible experience. There are a few people that kind of are staying cool with it, you know, and that’s the people that were filming it, actually. But man, the rest of them, it was. That’s amazing. Cracks me up.

1:08:13 – Jim Serpico
All right, Josh, thank you so much for talking to me.

1:08:16 – Joshua Grange
Yeah, Jim, of course, pleasure, thank you so much.

1:08:18 – Jim Serpico
This was great. I am a user of Josh’s product. I am not on his payroll. I suggest that if you are interested in baking bread, you give this thing a try. I’m sure you’re gonna love it as much as I do. Go to getdope.com. You’re on Instagram too, right, at Get Dope?

1:08:39 – Joshua Grange
Yes, that’s exactly right. Get dope. D-O-A-P. You got it.

1:08:43 – Unidentified Speaker
All right, man. Thank you so much. Thank you, Jim. That’s a pleasure. Good time. See ya.

1:08:51 – Unidentified Speaker
This episode of Bread for the People was brought to you by Side Hustle Bread, Long Island’s handcrafted artisanal bread company. Side Hustle Bread is a family-run business that’s bringing the neighborhood feel back to Long Island one loaf at a time. If you like what you’re hearing, don’t forget to head on over to iTunes and rate and review this episode. Reviewing and rating is the most effective way to help us grow our audience. This episode was produced by Milestone TV and Film. I’m your host, Jim Serpico. Blessed be the bread, everyone.